Talk:Ali Javan

Genius claim

Dubious Telegraph source (2) which ranks Matt Groening at number 4 and Osama Bin Laden at number 42. I would not be so happy to be on such a list, particularly since it was compiled through an opinion survey of 4,000 Britons, effectively making the genius claim outright false and POV. 77.124.125.63 (talk) 19:09, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

Azeri origin

This source is just a personal weblog/website and it can't be used on Wikipedia. This one is a news website, it's not a biographical source, and most importantly, it DOESN'T say that he is an Azeri. Cite a reliable biographical source. -- Kouhi (talk) 14:35, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

I still do not understand why we must not use this source.

Inventions & Discoveries. p. 27. Ali Javan is an Iranian Azeri inventor and physicist at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT). John Francis Templeson (talk) 20:34, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Kouhi and John Francis Templeson: The ethnicity of his parents is very well-established - cited after "Scientists Who Made A Difference" by Betty Blair (Azerbaijan International, 1996). This is the primary source. Almost all other references that mention his ethnicity (including those websites) are derived from this one source. There is no reason to cite additional unreliable sources to bolster this claim. The parents were Azeri from Tabriz (stated in the article already), he was born in Tehran and often self-identified as "Persian" (e.g. OSA interview or Smithsonian). So the description "Iranian-American" is fairly accurate.

P.S. I am the person who laboriously wrote this entire article on Ali Javan (starting in 2012 to present). Over the years, I have been the only person with an interest and with enough academic credentials to explain his actual scientific achievements. Sadly, all other edits to this article by others have been vying over his nationality/ethnicity. Telementor (talk) 03:03, 25 February 2018 (UTC)

Name in Persian

Mazandar (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). I am still waiting your arguements. Why we must give spelling of his name in Persian just because he was born in Iran? Maybe we must use the Azeri spelling of Lev Landau's name, why not? John Francis Templeson (talk) 20:41, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Because the spelling has nothing to do with ethnicity. It is related to language, not ethnicity. And beside that, he has nothing to do with the Republic of Azerbaijan and the Latin alphabet of the Republic of Azerbaijan. -- Mazandar (talk) 20:47, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Have you any sources that he was speaking mainly in Persian? We have sources that he was an Azeri and therefore at least knew Azeri. I added Azeri spelling in Arabic and Azeri spelling in world-wide recognized Latin alphabet. John Francis Templeson (talk) 20:51, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Oh my God, you reverted even spelling in Arabic form. What is wrong?? John Francis Templeson (talk) 20:52, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Again, it has NOTHING to do with ethnicity. See related articles, like the articles of Islamic era scholars. We only included Arabic spelling (or other closely related languages to the subject of the article), not Persian, Syrian, Indian, Greek spellings. This is a well-established rule in the wiki. -- Mazandar (talk) 20:55, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Beside that, the article still lacks a reliable biographical source for his Azeri origin. -- Mazandar (talk) 20:57, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Because he was an Iranian, simple as that. --HistoryofIran (talk) 11:51, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

Lev Landau also was Azerbaijani citizen. What else? John Francis Templeson (talk) 20:20, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

John Francis Templeson: Your analogy with Lev Landau is flawed partly because Landau never self-identified as an Azeri - he was Soviet by nationality and I presume Ashekenazi by ethnicity. In all likelihood, Persian was Javan's native language. He could speak and also published in French. There are interviews with him in Perian. The Azeri ethnicity of his parents is well-established (cited after “Scientists Who Made A Difference” by Betty, 1996). However, there is not a single reference that shows he could speak Azeri himself.

Ali Javan personally self-identified as "Persian", for instance in the interview with OSA (September 2008):

"The discovery of gas discharge in neon lamps... I remember as a Persian – somebody was there already selling the – what is it, the fluorescent lights."

Further, he was almost always referred to by his associates as "Persian". For instance in one of our primary references (Smithsonian Magazine, April 1971):

"At home Ali relaxes on an oversized ottoman like a Persian prince."

He considered himself an Iranian/Iranian-American (he once tried to establish a laser institute in Iran - not in Azerbaijan). Telementor (talk) 05:08, 23 February 2018 (UTC)

Latin Spelling

As indicated in the page for Azeri language, the Iranian-Azeri language uses the Perso-Arabic alphabet, not Latin. Dr. Javan is from Iran, not the Republic of Azerbaijan, thus the Latin spelling is utterly irrelevant. His surname is a Persian term meaning "young". The spelling of his name is identical in both Iranian-Azeri and Persian (جوان). Telementor (talk) 01:46, 19 August 2014 (UTC)

However, Azerbaijani script should be mentioned in two variants: 1) arabic, because he is from Iran 2) latin, because it it internationally recognized script for Azerbaijani language. If you want you can add IPA for his name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Somebody (talk • contribs) 12:12, 19 August 2014‎ (UTC)

The page for Azerbaijani alphabet clearly states that in Iran the Perso-Arabic script is still officially used to write the Azeri language. Latin is internationally recognized for the Republic of Azerbaijan. Hence we must only include the relevant script used by his parents and other Iranian Azerbaijanis. In any event, if you must add the Latin script, then the same standard should apply to articles of ALL other Iranians with Azeri heritage, such as Khamenei, Ali Daei, Sattar Khan, etc. There should not be a double standard. It is also noteworthy that Dr. Ali Javan only speaks Persian, French, and English. He does not speak Azeri.Telementor (talk) 10:59, 20 August 2014 (UTC)

Well, I appreciate your edits, but they have nothing in common with factual accurancy. I repeat, if you want we can add IPA for his name instead of Persian or Azerbaijani script. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Somebody (talk • contribs) 09:06, 20 August 2014‎ (UTC)

Sure, I am in favor of adding the IPA, in order to avoid further editing conflict. However, my point remains that if we adopt a certain spelling system, then we must be consistent throughout all the articles. According to Wikipedia, there is no universal script for Azerbaijani language, so Dr. Javan being a native of Iran, Perso-Arabic is the one used by Iranian Azerbaijanis (the one that also appears in his birth certificate). Thanks. Telementor (talk) 11:39, 20 August 2014 (UTC)

I am happy, that we found a compromise. I hope you will help me to stop vandalism. I think, IPA is better for Wikipedia, than native scripts, because not everyone can understand chinese script, for example. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Somebody (talk • contribs) 11:46, 20 August 2014‎ (UTC)

External links modified

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External links modified

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I have just modified 2 external links on Ali Javan. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

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Ethnicity of Ali Javan should not be removed and reverted by users Kurdo777 and Xashaiar and Gazaneh

Ethnicity of Ali Javan, who is ethnically Azerbaijani, should not be removed and reverted by users Kurdo777 and Xashaiar and Gazaneh like they have done here [1] and here [2] and here [3] and again here [4]. Why is it that Kurdo777 is always seen to be engaged in such reverts? --Saygi1 (talk) 00:22, 30 September 2011 (UTC)

That's not the matter of ethnicity at all. Persian is the only official language used throughout of Iran. Therefore, using other spellings than Persian (which is the original one) and English (which is relevant since the page is in English and he is also a citizen of an English-language country--USA) is completely irrelevant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 5.221.217.36 (talk) 18:12, 23 July 2014‎ (UTC)

This is English Wikipedia. English uses the Latin alphabet. Therefore it is informative to our readers what the transliteration into the Latin alphabet is.

You are edit warring. One more revert, and you will be reported. BMK (talk) 23:04, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

name in Azerbaijani with arabic script

hi everybody. Can i add his name in Azerbaijani with arabic script. Also as i understand there was a discussion about that, but i dont see the conclusion. Thanks for response