Talk:Francisco Rodríguez (Venezuelan pitcher)

Semi-protect

Semi-protected for 24 hours for WP:CRYSTAL-vio edits. The deal should be officially announced by then. --Madchester (talk) 22:24, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Article name

I thought it makes sense to move the article to Francisco Rodríguez (closer). The move was reverted apparently. Any opinions, comments, etc. ?--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 23:14, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

I propose moving them to Francisco José Rodríguez and Francisco Rodríguez Murillo respectively, along the lines of Francisco Javier Rodríguez and Francisco Rodríguez García. -- Y not? 13:43, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

See WP:QUALIFIER and the Steve Smith example. Based on that, I think it should be: Francisco Rodríguez (baseball) and Francisco Rodríguez Murillo. Nevermind, I didn't know of the baseball naming convention Spanneraol listed below. — X96lee15 (talk) 15:30, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

• See Wikipedia:Naming conventions (baseball players). The page is named correctly. Spanneraol (talk) 15:33, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

The article is named correctly - K-Rod was not a closer when he came up and closer is not a position in baseball. He should not be named Jose or Murillo because he does not go by his full name. It is just a weird perdicument to be put in - also their are two Chris Carter's in the league also. Ositadinma 21:23, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

Agreed with Ositadinma. As I said when I reverted the page move, closer is not an official baseball position and Rodriguez will not spend his entire career as closer. I'd consider it the same as disambiguating Barack Obama (if it were needed) with "(president)" rather than "(politician)". There is no reason to get so specific when it's not a role he's always going to fill. A player may very well be a pitcher, infielder, or outfielder throughout his career (or maybe even a specific position in the field) but you usually won't ALWAYS be a closer.►Chris Nelson^Holla! 00:04, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

You know, guys and gals, the guideline is not gospel. It's a freaking guideline. And here you've got Latin Americans who have second surnames - why not just just use them. We use middle names all the time to dab commonly named people who "do not go by their full names", and we use patronymics for Russians which aren't even "their" names at all. These second surnames should be no different. Your guideline (which I'm going to go rewrite soon) is leading to an absurd result. "Francisco Rodríguez (baseball, born 1982)" is a horrible article name. -- Y not? 03:20, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

The guideline is the result of consensus among the baseball project, you shouldn't rewrite it without discussion. Spanneraol (talk) 03:36, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Y - I think in general, giving people names in article titles that they aren't commonly known by. If you're searching for Francisco Rodriguez, you're not going to know to look him up by his birth name. Dikembe Mutumbo has about seven names we don't use, but we shouldn't use them because nobody knows him as that. It's just a bad idea all around.►Chris Nelson^Holla! 15:48, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

The thing is different wiki projects have different naming conventions (e.i., Royalty, soccer players, etc.) are a few examples were their are different naming conventions than normal (soccer players with one name and royalty with Dame, King and Prince, etc). Baseball does not have that, so unless or until K-Rod goes by his birth name or other name then the article will be Francisco Rodriguez and not Jose or Murillo part. Ositadinma 16:46, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

• Opposed as well to disambiguating by full official name. The first thing people think of when hearing of the more notable F-Rod is "closer." Hence thats the disambuguater that makes the most sense, and most consistent with the general approach of wp:mosdab. The specific baseball guidelines have nothing against disambiuting by "closer" and "relief pitcher". First of all, "closer" is a position and is notated as much in contemporary statistics. But whether they are "positons" or not is irrelevant because the guidelines encourage non-position disambiguations. Wikipedia:Naming conventions (baseball players) #2 says to disambiguate by "manager", which is not a position. #4 disambiguates by left-handesness vs. right handedness, neither of which are postions last time I checked.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 02:02, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

Requested move 1

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page not moved. Arbitrarily0 ^(talk) 01:48, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

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Francisco Rodríguez (baseball, born 1982) → Francisco Rodríguez (baseball) – He is clearly the primary topic. The other Francisco Rodríguez is not nearly as famous as this one. This one has the record for most saves in a season while the other one has nothing notable about him. A similar situation exists with Adrian Peterson and Adrian N. Peterson. JDDJS (talk) 21:16, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Primary topic doesn't work like that. If he's not the primary topic for Francisco Rodriguez, then he needs a unique disambiguator. Powers ^T 23:14, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

• Oppose per Powers who says it more succinctly than I ever could. Jenks24 (talk) 08:14, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
• Oppose Also per Powers. Dealing with these sort of situations is rather clear disambig. is the most appropriate.--Labattblueboy (talk) 19:54, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested Move 2

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Move. Jafeluv (talk) 10:50, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

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• Francisco Rodríguez (baseball, born 1982) → Francisco Rodríguez (Venezuelan pitcher)
• Francisco Rodríguez (baseball, born 1983) → Francisco Rodríguez (Mexican pitcher)

– The birthdates for these pitchers are just over a year apart, making it nearly impossible to tell which pitcher is which. I propose moving to nationality because that will be more recognizable. Also, that was what was chosen in the case of the Ramón Ramírez's. Sanfranciscogiants17 (talk) 11:10, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

• Heh, a successful move at Ramon Ramirez is inspiring you, eh? I'll support this. – Muboshgu (talk) 13:37, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
• Support. Beneficial to the reader as it is far more likely they will know the player's nationality than whether they were born in 1982 or '83. Jenks24 (talk) 04:06, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
• Support. I prefer the team name (just change it again when the team changes), but this is better than the current format.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 12:57, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

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