Talk:Micelle

Milk

can someone add milk to the article. the fat globules in milk are contained in micelles structured by k-casein molecule. those micelles are also responsible for the white color (because of emulsion light dispersion). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.250.197.190 (talk) 21:57, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

I have never heard anyone refer to micelles as micellae

How do you pronounce "micelle"?

  Try saying "My Seal" That works for me...(Lance Tyrell)

Everyone says "My Sell" [usa at least] (johnM) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Xxjohnmxx (talk • contribs) 18:47, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

I think this might be like using penes as the plural for penis. It may be proper but it just isn't done.24.181.29.106

Should this page be merged (together with lipid bilayer) to a new heading "lipid structures"? --Eleassar777 14:50, 24 May 2005 (UTC)

I don't think so, as micelles can be formed by chemicals other than lipids. --Solidpeg 00:39, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Shouldn't pronunciations be verifiable in another reference (e.g., OED)? I don't think "my seal" is considered standard at this point. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.32.205.160 (talk) 01:26, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

The following information is taken from The American Heritage Dictionary of the American Language, page 828 (1975 edition, which happens to be on the shelf behind my desk — is it time to get another one?):

micelle, plural micelles.

Also micella, plural micellae, which is actually New Latin. Consequently, you should use micellae only if you use micella; I have no idea how common the Latin forms are compared to the anglicized forms in chemical and biological English usage.

Personally, I think there is no etymological justification for the pronunciation "My Seal", as the double-L normally indicates a "short" vowel no matter what follows it. It should be pronounced "My Cell", thinking that the solvophobic material is imprisoned inside. Can anyone cite a dictionary which allows "My Seal"? -- Solo Owl 14:42, 24 September 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eall Ân Ûle (talk • contribs)

Attention needed

I had this page on my watchlist, and some recent edits seem to have messed it up. I'm not sure what the correct version of this page is, but I'm concerned about the recent edits. --DannyWilde 08:05, 8 November 2005 (UTC)

Actually i'm still not sure about this. Perhaps any talent can edit it in order to make it clearer? Thanks...--Winter1211 17:36, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

Driving force?

The driving force for formation of the micelle is better to be explained by the Gibbs free energy. In fact one can just using the regular solution theory to give a good and quantitative arguement.

Micelles increases entropy

The aggregation of amphiphatic molecules actually increases the entropy of the surrounding water molecules. Water molecules build hydrogen bonds to other polar molecules. If an amphiphatic or hydrophobic molecule is immersed in water, water molecules next to the concerned molecule have a reduced number of possible partners for hydrogen bonding - and their order is increased (="small entropy"). In order to increase entropy ("disorder") of the water molecules, amphiphatic or hydrophic molecules aggregate which actually decreases the surface/volume ratio. The ordering of water molecules around the hydrophic molecule or the hydrophobic part of the amphiphatic molecule is called clathrate structure or cage. That's why dispersed oil droplets in water will always form a big oil drop. The dispersed oil droplets refers to high order (of water molecules) and the big drop refers to small order of water molecules.

See Alberts: "Molecular Biology of the Cell"

• The hydrophobic effect is not necessarily entropic; it can be enthalpic. This depends on the temperature. See "Proteins" by Creighton. Biophys 21:22, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

plural form

This article says that the plural is micellae, then uses micelles throughout! Jeff Knaggs 08:38, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

admicelles

Anyone what to add some info on admicelles? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.169.197.37 (talk) 22:16, 21 August 2008 (UTC)

Second the motion. Google Scholar returns over 2000 hits for admicelle and over 3000 for hemimicelle. Neither word occurs in Wikipedia. [And I thought Wikipedia was my friend :-( .] There seems to be enough notability to at least mention these two concepts on the Micelle page. And give illustrations like the ones in the infobox — better than any verbal definition! -- Solo Owl 14:57, 24 September 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eall Ân Ûle (talk • contribs)

Willard Water mention and ref is over the top

I'm somewhat sympathetic to exotic phenomenon, *IF* there's some reasonable basis, so I followed the Willard Water link to a 1980 "60 Minutes" transcript, and read...complete crap.

I am not going to try to delete this from the article, since some fabulist will probably defend it, and I don't care enough to wage that battle, but I really do think that that pseudo-science is *entirely* inappropriate on this page. to the author. charcoal water is at least proven to accept extra nutrients for plants due to the friggin charcoal you meathead boom thats science. Body PH is crap science though if your reading this and thinking to drink it just don't. It will at the very least remove nutrients from your body.

-you could use it to extract nutrients from a plant and then cook this stuff off with some ethanol — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.38.114.148 (talk) 06:28, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

Pronunciation

The introduction to the article says the correct pronunciation is /maɪˈsiːl/ ("my seal"). I am an undergraduate biochemistry student, and frequently work with micelles similar structures, and I have never heard this before; all of my professors pronounce the word as /maɪˈsɛl/ ("my sell"). I will leave in the current version, but I am also adding this one. mj_sklar (talk) 16:04, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

See my comment above for a dictionary reference. If no one can cite a dictionary that says My Seal, I will delete it in a few months. -- Solo Owl 15:00, 24 September 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eall Ân Ûle (talk • contribs)

Its pronounced my sell.Chhe (talk) 23:47, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

The following dictionary lists it with the correct pronunciation (mi sel'). Namely, The Random House College Dictionary Revised Edition 1975, ISBN 0394435001 on page 843.Chhe (talk) 00:13, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

Packing Parameter

Is it worth linking to Thermodynamics_of_micellization#Surfactant_packing_parameter ? 131.111.203.169 (talk) 22:33, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

Intro excludes comprehensive meaning of "micelle"

The intro needs more qualification. Micelles are about more instances than soapy water, such as in polymer chemistry or biological phenomena. The polymer type is cited in the quote of the IUPAC definition, but the intro is all about detergents and excludes all other forms. Richard J Kinch (talk) 09:16, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

make page: nanomicelle

• https://www.google.com/search?q=nanomicelle — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:587:4104:1E4C:48EA:D10C:BC6:FCEC (talk) 09:49, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

IUPAC definition

The IUPAC definition does not match the version I can find "Surfactants in solution are often association colloids, that is, they tend to form aggregates of colloidal dimensions, which exist in equilibrium with the molecules or ions from which they are formed. Such aggregates are termed micelles." (https://goldbook.iupac.org/terms/view/M03889). I would add this definition seems somewhat vague. Where does the cited IUPAC definition actually originate? 213.121.92.171 (talk) 10:32, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Incorrect Figure

I suggest immediately deleting the figure "Scheme of a micelle formed by phospholipids in an aqueous solution" Firstly, two-tailed amphiphiles including phospholipids tend to form bilayers, not micelles. It is one of the basic principles of amphiphile assembly that one-tailed amphiphiles like SDS, but not two-tailed amphiphiles, form micelles. Secondly the head groups in that figure are spaced far apart, appearing to suggest that water can penetrate into the hydrophobic core. That is not right either. So in my view that figure should be deleted or replaced by a micelle made by a one-tailed amphipath, with better packing of the head groups.

For more information, you can check the paper below, which says "Typical vesicles are formed by synthetic or natural phospholipids (liposomes) and are generally composed of one hydrophilic head and two hydrophobic tails [4, 5]. When phospholipids are dispersed in water, they tend to aggregate spontaneously to form bilayers, which resemble the types of structures they form in biological membranes."

Source: https://doi.org/10.1155/2015/151683 LDWilliams (talk) 20:28, 18 November 2024 (UTC)

Later: Now I see that there are other figures on this page showing two-tailed amphiphiles in micelles. These are all wrong. — Preceding unsigned comment added by LDWilliams (talk • contribs) 07:34, 20 November 2024 (UTC)