Talk:Tartar (river)

Comment

Tartarchay's native name is Tartar, as the river is in former Greater Armenia's and now in Artsakh republic's territory, the native name should be the Armenian one.Aram-van--Aram-van (talk) 08:23, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Right... What else is Armenian? Tartarchay is the name of the river located in Azerbaijan Republic. If necessary, please consider checking the sources. Tuscumbia (talk) 14:58, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

No need. Tartarchay is located in Artsakh republic. When Azeris came to that territory? That territories are inhabited by Armenians for 5000 year, and I think the Armenian name should be written! Aram-van--Aram-van (talk) 18:17, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Really, and you're basing your argument on what? Show me a single third party source or international document indicating such an entity called "Artsakh Republic" even exists. Tuscumbia (talk) 21:55, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

I wasn't aware that inhabitants of a region needed an "international document" before they could use their name for a river. Where is the "international document" that says Londoners have the right to call their river the "Thames", or their city "London"? 03:28, 12 January 2011 (UTC)93.97.143.19 (talk

Listen Tuscumbia, ([[1]]) Artsakh or Nagorno-Karabakh republic is an independent state, want some prove, read in Wikipedia about Nagorno-Karabakh. Artsakh has been Armenian, is Armenian and will be Armenian. And the people living there have the right to name the river. For your information Tartarchay is from Armenian word Tartar. So I'm moving this page where it belongs.Aram-van--Aram-van (talk) 06:28, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

By the way, doesn't chay mean "river" in Azeri? Isn't Tartarchay river translated as Tartar river river? -- Ashot  ^(talk) 19:19, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Yes it does mean river, but your argument has not substance because the same can be applied to other titles such as Artsvaberd, Hnaberd, Karaberd, Lori Berd where the word berd means town/city. It's just the title given to the city. The river has a name Tartarchay. In translation it would be Tartarchay river. Tuscumbia (talk) 19:33, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Listen for your information berd doesn't just mean town/city, it means a fortified city with fences around, so it could used as a defense against enemies. And berd isn't always a title, there is a fortress in Lori which is called Lori Berd, there is an ancient Urartian fortress in Hnaberd. Why is Tartarchay so similar to the Armenian Tartar? Why when you take out chay, which means river, we get Tartar? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aram-van (talk • contribs) 05:36, 13 January 2011 (UTC) Qarqar river's name in Azerbaijani is Qarqarchay, do you think that chay is just a title given to a river!Aram-van--Aram-van (talk) 05:42, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Tartar is not an Armenian word. If it were an Armenian word, do you think Azerbaijani government would keep the name? Tuscumbia (talk) 14:56, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Do you consider this argument? -- Ashot  ^(talk) 16:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Do you consider Aram-van's statement an argument? I don't think he's an expert on linguistics, is he? Why would Tartar be an Armenian name and not Azeri or Old Udi? Tuscumbia (talk) 16:21, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Well, we can ask him for arguments...

As for me I can say that Tartar comes from "Trtu", "Tiratu" = Tir - a - tu, meaning given from Tir, a pagan Armenian god. -- Ashot  ^(talk) 17:17, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

It comes as reference to Tatars also called Tartar. Tuscumbia (talk) 18:04, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

For your information Tuscumbia, in Turkey they change Armenian names into Turkish, like Marash into Kahramanmaraş, they just change one letter in the world to sound more Armenian. Why do you think Azeris aren't doing the same thing. They've destroyed Julfa's Khachkar's (Khachkar destruction in Nakhchivan), they destroy Armenian monasteries and churches or change them into Albanian. Ashot did you know, that Tsiternavanq monastery, which they named Apoglan and consider an Albanian one (actually it's an Armenian one), was in semi-destructed situation, when it was under Azeri control, but know, after Armenian reconstruction is a working church. And you think Azeris wouldn't just hange the name?Aram-van--Aram-van (talk) 20:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

POV arguments. I don't see any sign of Azerbaijani culture left in Armenia. I wonder what happened to it, or did hundreds of thousands of ethnic Azerbaijanis forget to leave a trace of their heritage in Armenia after living there for hundreds of years? Tuscumbia (talk) 15:28, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Azerbaijanis living 100s of years sounds interesting. -- Ashot  ^(talk) 16:18, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Protected

I'm seeing a lot of reverting while a discussion is going on, a lot of reverting without reasoning, and, worst of all, move-warring. That's a big no-no. It makes admins sad. Protected for a week while y'all sort things out. --Golbez (talk) 17:33, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

I can explain the changes I made:First:Tartar river-394,000 results in Google Tartarchay-544 results in Google, second, the natives of that region call the river Tartar not Tartarchay, Armenians live their longer than Azeris. What about you? Aram-van--Aram-van (talk) 15:19, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

This article is about geography and according to WP:NPOV all important opinions should be presented. Please read the rules, Aram van. --Quantum666 (talk) 15:55, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

Controversial text

Have removed the following text from the article:

"Sarsang reservoir built on the on the river is often not used by Armenians which causes disastrous floods in the Azerbaijani village of [[Zümürxan]] near the front line where the [[Refugees and internally displaced persons in Azerbaijan|Azerbaijani refugees forced out]] from Kalbajar and [[Lachin Rayon|Lachin]] raions were placed.<ref>[http://az.itv.az/azerbaijan/10304.html Tərtərçay təhlükə mənbəyinə çevrilib]</ref>".

First of all would like to have a neutral English source for the core idea underlying the text. Then it probably may be reworded to become more neutral and be placed back in the article. -- Ashot  ^(talk) 17:42, 26 February 2011 (UTC)